How are you?

[skorpan420]

By following the law of attraction you are lying to yourself. Don't get me wrong here, stick with me and I'll get to my point.

In the secret for example, they tell you to act, think, and feel as if you have something that you don't have. By doing that, you are lying to yourself. Whether it makes you feel good or not, you can not say that it is not lying to yourself because it is. Telling myself that I have a Ferrari when I don't have one is lying to myself. If the intention is making myself feel good, and if I succeed with feeling good or not, I am actually lying to myself.

Lying to myself makes me feel bad. I might feel good at first when imagining myself being the person I want to be, but it can't go on forever because there is a reality which can't be ignored. When I say to myself for example that I have a guitar, and I wake up and see that there is no guitar there, it doesn't matter how long I wait for it to come. I am lying to myself, and that makes me feel horrible. I engage in some sort of emotional rollercoaster because of the beliefs that are constantly being provocated in my being.

Then again, comes the question. What else can one do?

I would like your opinion on this.

[Stefzilla]

You need to shift your focus from that angle. You want a guitar but yet you know its not coming, and you know when you wake up it wont be there. So guess what.. its not going to come.

LOA is not magic in the sense of im going to wish for a guitar, and then wake up with it under my pillow. The process is of desire and wanting, and knowing you can have it , and then releasing any negative thoughts of it not being possible.

Then guess what you might be walking down the street and see someone selling one for dirt cheap, or you might get it as a gift from a friend or stranger. You don’t know how it will come into your life, or what steps you need to actually make to get to it.

So instead of thinking im just sitting here fooling myself, think I will have it and it will come into my life. Sometimes when we least expect things they will show up for us.

[skorpan420]

You need to shift your focus from that angle. You want a guitar but yet you know its not coming, and you know when you wake up it wont be there. So guess what.. its not going to come.

LOA is not magic in the sense of im going to wish for a guitar, and then wake up with it under my pillow. The process is of desire and wanting, and knowing you can have it , and then releasing any negative thoughts of it not being possible.

Then guess what you might be walking down the street and see someone selling one for dirt cheap, or you might get it as a gift from a friend or stranger. You don’t know how it will come into your life, or what steps you need to actually make to get to it.

So instead of thinking im just sitting here fooling myself, think I will have it and it will come into my life. Sometimes when we least expect things they will show up for us.

Uhm, but thats not the point. The thing is that they say in the secret to think as if I already have it. They are not encouraging me to say "I will have it", they are telling me to say "I have it", when in fact, I don't. Sure, I know I can get it. That is totally for sure, I mean to say that walking around telling yourself the specific "I already have ****" when you don't is lying to yourself.

There is a difference between longing for, and wanting something. If I work and get the money, I can long for the guitar to be shipped to my door and that feels good, sure. Or I can hope for someone to give the guitar to me without me expecting it. But to walk around suggesting to myself that I already have it, when in fact I don't, is just delusional. You must agree with me?

[tereza]

When I say to myself for example that I have a guitar, and I wake up and see that there is no guitar there, it doesn't matter how long I wait for it to come. I am lying to myself, and that makes me feel horrible. I engage in some sort of emotional rollercoaster because of the beliefs that are constantly being provocated in my being.

We lie to ourselves all the time, telling ourselves we don't have enough time, we can't afford it, it's impossible or the timing isn't right, but for some reason that's ok, because we've convinced ourselves that what we're doing is safe, reasonable and practical. But the truth is, other people in similar situations manage to get the very things we want, so we're really holding ourselves back with all this practical thinking.

Anyway, it seems to me, you're more upset by the fact that what you want isn't there, than you are about lying to yourself. What's not working out for you? What are you trying to manifest?

[lise]

Is it not more that they suggest you act as if you have it and not that you have it? The distinction being you're changing your feeling from a feeling of lack to a feeling of what it would be like to have it.
 So with your guitar example, they're not suggesting you book lessons and then turn up with your imaginary guitar but instead to act as if you would if you had one eg look into where you could get lessons, where the best place to buy accessories from, where you'd put it in your house and make room for it, thereby shifting the feeling to one of happy anticipation and away from not having.

We lie to ourselves all the time and feel quite ok with it. I say I'm going to get up when the alarm first goes off, I tell myself I'm only going to eat one biscuit and not half a packet. I don't have an issue with it unless it's hurting myself or someone else.

[skorpan420]

When I say to myself for example that I have a guitar, and I wake up and see that there is no guitar there, it doesn't matter how long I wait for it to come. I am lying to myself, and that makes me feel horrible. I engage in some sort of emotional rollercoaster because of the beliefs that are constantly being provocated in my being.

We lie to ourselves all the time, telling ourselves we don't have enough time, we can't afford it, it's impossible or the timing isn't right, but for some reason that's ok, because we've convinced ourselves that what we're doing is safe, reasonable and practical. But the truth is, other people in similar situations manage to get the very things we want, so we're really holding ourselves back with all this practical thinking.

Anyway, it seems to me, you're more upset by the fact that what you want isn't there, than you are about lying to yourself. What's not working out for you? What are you trying to manifest?

Well, no, we don't lie to ourselves all the time. I can go all day long and tell myself "I have the time to finish my exam today". You can be positive without lying to yourself. Telling myself that I have a guitar when I don't is not thinking positive, it is delusional. Let me quote Thom Yorke from Radiohead

"Just cause you feel it, doesn't mean it's there".

If you want to listen to some music:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuaPkGZ-HIA&feature=related

(really good song in my opinion!)

And no, what I want is there. I want a house, and it is there. It is not in my possession, since someone else owns it. So I don't have the house. Telling myself that I have the house would be delusional. Telling myself that I can get the house is positive. Because I can. But I don't Have the house. 

Also, I want money. I dont have that either. But I can get it if I work for it. It is not going to manifest, I am going to go and get it. I am going to work, so that people want to give the money to me. Manifestation has nothing to do with achieving goals and aquiring what I want to have.

[testfest]

what you say is clever,
the way to use the law is,

#1 it is not about fake it until you make it, because you can't fool yourself by faking/giving lies to yourself

#2 the law of attraction gives you what you think x emotions
so if you think about ferrari and feel good, it is not gonna work

#3 however you can feel good by knowing that if you think and feel  about a thing long enough you will be creating more and more circumstances where your dreams is coming to you closer  and closer
that's how you can feel good, by anticipating,

i am sure, when you will be attracting it will be more believable for you, and it is not just coincidence,

there are times when i blow my mind by what i attract,

good luck

for free audio recordings of Bob Proctor visit here:
http://tinyurl.com/Free-Bob-Proctor-cds

[skorpan420]

Is it not more that they suggest you act as if you have it and not that you have it? The distinction being you're changing your feeling from a feeling of lack to a feeling of what it would be like to have it.
 So with your guitar example, they're not suggesting you book lessons and then turn up with your imaginary guitar but instead to act as if you would if you had one eg look into where you could get lessons, where the best place to buy accessories from, where you'd put it in your house and make room for it, thereby shifting the feeling to one of happy anticipation and away from not having.

We lie to ourselves all the time and feel quite ok with it. I say I'm going to get up when the alarm first goes off, I tell myself I'm only going to eat one biscuit and not half a packet. I don't have an issue with it unless it's hurting myself or someone else.

Acting as if I have what I want is wishful thinking, and can by other words be called daydreaming. Nothing wrong with that, it summons ideas. Sure, it manifests oppurtunities, since I see them when daydreaming. "Of if I just could have a bisquit, OH, I CAN BUY ONE" voila, the universe told me that there is bisquits at the supermarket.

And again, no, we don't lie to ourselves all the time. Or, maybe you do that. But not all of humanity does just because you do it. Who told you that we lie to ourselves all the time? And why would that be a motivation to start getting delusional? Its not that being delusional makes anything better than lying to oneself all the time. Telling yourself that you can't play guitar is not lying. Its a negative attitude. Telling yourself that you can play guitar, is positive. Telling yourself that you can play guitar when you never played before, when actually, you haven't, is delusional. Telling yourself that you can play just as good as, lets say, Johnny greenwood in radiohead, when in fact, you can't, is delusional. Telling yourself that can learn to play as, for example, as fast as he does, thats a positive attitude.

The people behind the Secret is taking something that is called being delusional, and making it look like it is something worth striving after. When it really, is the worst you can do. How do you think they made the movie? Do you think they sat down and wished for it to happen, and then suddenly, people manifested? No. They said "we can make a movie. We have not made a movie, but we can do it." then they did it.

And yes, it can be dangerous to be delusional. Thats why I don't daydream when crossing the road. Or when I cut vegetables with a knife. When I go to sleep, sure.

[skorpan420]

what you say is clever,
the way to use the law is,

#1 it is not about fake it until you make it, because you can't fool yourself by faking/giving lies to yourself

#2 the law of attraction gives you what you think x emotions
so if you think about ferrari and feel good, it is not gonna work

#3 however you can feel good by knowing that if you think and feel  about a thing long enough you will be creating more and more circumstances where your dreams is coming to you closer  and closer
that's how you can feel good, by anticipating,

i am sure, when you will be attracting it will be more believable for you, and it is not just coincidence,

there are times when i blow my mind by what i attract,

good luck

for free audio recordings of Bob Proctor visit here:
http://tinyurl.com/Free-Bob-Proctor-cds

How can you apply something that is already there? This is another gigantic wormhole in the secret. First they say that the LOA is Always working. All the time, and has been, all the time. Then all of a sudden, they are speaking about "applying it", by being greatful for example. Being greatful is not called LOA. It is called being greatful. Asking for something is not called LOA, it is called asking for something.

[tereza]

And no, what I want is there. I want a house, and it is there. It is not in my possession, since someone else owns it. So I don't have the house. Telling myself that I have the house would be delusional. Telling myself that I can get the house is positive. Because I can. But I don't Have the house.

Also, I want money. I dont have that either. But I can get it if I work for it. It is not going to manifest, I am going to go and get it. I am going to work, so that people want to give the money to me. Manifestation has nothing to do with achieving goals and aquiring what I want to have.
 

I haven't tried manifesting a house yet. But with money, telling myself that I have it, has been working out for me. But whatever. It's different for everyone, so continue doing what works for you.

The people behind the Secret is taking something that is called being delusional, and making it look like it is something worth striving after. When it really, is the worst you can do. How do you think they made the movie? Do you think they sat down and wished for it to happen, and then suddenly, people manifested? No. They said "we can make a movie. We have not made a movie, but we can do it." then they did it.

And yes, it can be dangerous to be delusional. Thats why I don't daydream when crossing the road. Or when I cut vegetables with a knife. When I go to sleep, sure.

I don't know, it's always come across to me, that they set their minds on something and then opportunities or ideas came up. It wasn't like, poof! My book and movie wrote itself.

[skorpan420]

And no, what I want is there. I want a house, and it is there. It is not in my possession, since someone else owns it. So I don't have the house. Telling myself that I have the house would be delusional. Telling myself that I can get the house is positive. Because I can. But I don't Have the house.

Also, I want money. I dont have that either. But I can get it if I work for it. It is not going to manifest, I am going to go and get it. I am going to work, so that people want to give the money to me. Manifestation has nothing to do with achieving goals and aquiring what I want to have.
 

I haven't tried manifesting a house yet. But with money, telling myself that I have it, has been working out for me. But whatever. It's different for everyone, so continue doing what works for you.

The people behind the Secret is taking something that is called being delusional, and making it look like it is something worth striving after. When it really, is the worst you can do. How do you think they made the movie? Do you think they sat down and wished for it to happen, and then suddenly, people manifested? No. They said "we can make a movie. We have not made a movie, but we can do it." then they did it.

And yes, it can be dangerous to be delusional. Thats why I don't daydream when crossing the road. Or when I cut vegetables with a knife. When I go to sleep, sure.

I don't know, it's always come across to me, that they set their minds on something and then opportunities or ideas came up. It wasn't like, poof! My book and movie wrote itself.

All I want to do is bring clarity to the LOA since it is quite foggy. Especially the "easy" part. And the "if you think positive everything will work out" and especielly the "tell a schizophrenic to think positive and it will work out" ..

And no, what I want is there. I want a house, and it is there. It is not in my possession, since someone else owns it. So I don't have the house. Telling myself that I have the house would be delusional. Telling myself that I can get the house is positive. Because I can. But I don't Have the house.

Also, I want money. I dont have that either. But I can get it if I work for it. It is not going to manifest, I am going to go and get it. I am going to work, so that people want to give the money to me. Manifestation has nothing to do with achieving goals and aquiring what I want to have.
 

I haven't tried manifesting a house yet. But with money, telling myself that I have it, has been working out for me. But whatever. It's different for everyone, so continue doing what works for you.

The people behind the Secret is taking something that is called being delusional, and making it look like it is something worth striving after. When it really, is the worst you can do. How do you think they made the movie? Do you think they sat down and wished for it to happen, and then suddenly, people manifested? No. They said "we can make a movie. We have not made a movie, but we can do it." then they did it.

And yes, it can be dangerous to be delusional. Thats why I don't daydream when crossing the road. Or when I cut vegetables with a knife. When I go to sleep, sure.

I don't know, it's always come across to me, that they set their minds on something and then opportunities or ideas came up. It wasn't like, poof! My book and movie wrote itself.

So you would not agree with me. If you have no money, and you then tell yourself you have money, you are not being delusional?

[tereza]

So what's your point? I'm a bit confused as to where you're going with all this. It seems you're saying that if you believe in the LoA or follow the book the Secret, you're delusional.

So you would not agree with me. If you have no money, and you then tell yourself you have money, you are not being delusional?

Well delusional implies a mental disorder. So no, I'm not being delusional. I'm making a deliberate decision not to focus on my current reality, so that I can change it.

[lise]

Then if you don't feel happy lying to yourself and feel it's not a good way to attract what you want - then don't do it. Do what works for you. I'm not really sure what your issue is? 

[MikeG]

Would you rather live in a world where you believe that everything doesn't have a reasoning and that your behaviour only affects occurences on a small basis? That you're insignificant and that you must have some natural talent to actually become something in this life?

Or would you rather live in a world where you're constantly improving yourself, making yourself happy, building your own point of view of life. No, you're not lying to yourself or anybody else. It's a point of view.
Everything can be seen as either positive or negative. Your friend having a bad grade can be positive, because he notices his flaws and decides, or not, to work on them.
Starving children can also be seen positive (bear with me), because it raises our attention to it and we help them to live the life they always wished they had.
In this world you CAN make a change, because it's so much easier to accept the fact that you're capable of it.

I'm reading a book currently about mindsets and how people are usually divided into two mindsets. Fixed and growth. The fixed mindset people only focus on showing off their skills and being the best there is by any means necessary. Failure is seen as something tragical and overwhelming.
The growth mindset people focus on the process of learning and feeling, which is basically what LoA believers do. These kind of people enjoy what they do and seek to improve themselves constantly, not caring if they ever become the best or not. Failure is just another way of saying "You have to work on this"


What I want to say with this post is that you aren't being forced to lie to yourself. You are basically building a new point of view. Whether this point of view is better or not, is completly left to you.

[truelove]

Nice one MikeG.